Update my PC

[rul3s]

Hello comrades!

I've found the possibility to upgrade my desktop PC without having to spend a lot of money, my current configuration is as follows:

**- i5 2500K

• AsRock p67 Extreme 6
• Corsair DDR3 1600 2x4GB CL9**
• Gigabyte GTX660 OC 2GB
• Corsair HX650
• Sound: X-Fi XtremeMusic + Asus Xonar DSX
• SSD Samsung 840 256GB (S.O) + SSD Samsung 830 128 (Games) + WD BLACK 2TB (Datos1) + WD Green (Datos2)
• Antec Twelve Hundred

As you can see, I'm renewing it little by little, and now what I want is to change CPU + MOTHERBOARD + RAM

I haven't had a good experience with this AsRock, sometimes it freezes and gets stuck when booting and the USB3.0 controller it has is a joke, and if it weren't for the motherboard, I probably wouldn't even consider changing platforms. What can you do, lately AsRock makes very good products, but I chose the bad one, and that cost 170€ at the time.
My intention was to get the following:

• CPU: i5 4670k or i5 4690K. Is it worth it? I just wanted an i5 that was K (For overclocking in the future)
• Motherboard: Here's where I have more doubts, Z87 or z97 chipset?
  Initially I had planned this one: Gigabyte Z97 HD3 but I'm open to suggestions.
• RAM: GsKill Trident X 2400 CL10 2x4GB

What do you think?

[Obione]

Have you updated the BIOS? Ideally, you would want to mount a 970.

[rul3s]

Yes! And since I updated the BIOS it does these weird things more often, I went from version 1.X to 2.X, the shame is that it won't let me go back!

When you say 970 do you mean Z97?

[_Neptunno_]

I think he tells you to use the money on a GTX970, which is a beast, instead of changing micro+motherboard+memory.

Personally, I would do that, upgrade the graphics card which is what you would notice the most, since a 2500K works very well and you wouldn't notice significant performance improvements overall and even less in games.
Another thing is that you want to tinker and do OC, but well, that would be more of a whim… only that it's more justified to change the graphics card... or at most if you don't like your motherboard, get another one and sell the one you have

Greetings, mate!!

[whoololon]

Man, I've always been of the opinion that the components of a team should be at the same level as each other: a lot of GPU and little CPU practically gives the same result as the inverse combination, the only thing that is rarely enough is RAM.
It will make no difference if a game drops FPS because the micro can't process so much physics as if it's the card that can't process so much effect at certain resolutions.

The thing about the micro (that it's K), Obione already explained it here, and regarding Z87 or Z97, if you're not going to change the micro I don't think it matters much, but you know "when in doubt…" ;D

[Sylver]

Honestly, it's scary that a fellow CPU user is going to make a change at this point in search of an improvement, and more so when I still haven't gotten the most out of mine :ugly: :ugly: :ugly: :ugly: :ugly:

Putting aside the scares, I agree with the proposal for the graphics card, and even the motherboard as well (or just her) with a view to ending those strange problems that your one gives, which you could sell and get an excellent improvement for almost… €0? Already depending on whether you sell yours and where you get the new one (or semi-new )

¡Saludos!

[Espinetenbolas]

@Rules:

As you can see, I am renewing it little by little, and now what I want is to change CPU + MOTHERBOARD + RAM

I have not had a good experience with this AsRock, sometimes it freezes and gets stuck at startup and the USB3.0 controller it has is a joke, and if it were not for the motherboard, I would probably not even consider changing platforms. What can I say, lately AsRock makes very good products, but I chose the bad one, and that cost 170€ at the time.

For and against Asrock (currently having an Asrock Z97 Extreme6) I must say that the quality is very good and it has two controllers for USB and SATA… the Intel controllers are luxurious but the others that are Asmedia are certainly a potato... ideal for plugging in the printer and elements that do not require high transfer rates or mechanical hard drives where the performance drop will not be noticed.

Otherwise, I have retired the X-Fi (creative and its drivers... I have ended up fed up) and the integrated one it brings is not bad at all (for listening to music I have more than enough) in fact, in several reviews they put it at the top since apparently the isolation it has is very good compared to even the Asus and Gigabyte.

That said, the Bios in Spanish is a real pain... I prefer it in English ;D

@Rules:

My intention was to get the following:

• CPU: i5 4670k or i5 4690K. Worth it? I just wanted an i5 that was K (For overclocking in the future)
• Motherboard: Here is where I have more doubts, Z87 or Z97 chipset?
  Initially I had planned this: Gigabyte Z97 HD3 but I am open to suggestions.
• RAM: GsKill Trident X 2400 CL10 2x4GB

What do you think?

As commented, you are barely going to notice the difference but in reality it all depends on the use, anyway I am going to comment:

• CPU: You won't notice much difference and between both it depends but you would notice the difference more if you put an i7, not only for having more cache and HT that increases multitasking performance by 50% but because the 4790K comes standard at 4Ghz with 4.4ghz turbo while many i5 or even many i7 4770K can't reach 4.2Ghz through OC due to temperature problems.
  That is to say, I at least do not see a substantial improvement: Intel Core i5 2500K vs 4690K or Intel Core i5 2500K vs 4790K

-Motherboard: Both chips are the same, the Z97 is a Z87 revamped to support SATAExpres and little more… if this feature matters little to you, you won't notice the slightest variation in performance in the rest of aspects.

• RAM: I don't see the need to put faster memos if you are not going to put more quantity since I don't consider it an improvement since you can always OC the memos… I would leave the same or get a good 16Gb kit. If there is no problem with them being high profile and I have to recommend one it would be a Crucial specifically BLE2CP8G3D1869DE1TX0CEU I have two of these (4 modules = 32Gb) and the performance is very good.

Without touching voltage (1.5V) or latencies (XPM with CR1) they work stable at 2000Mhz:

To summarize, and as already commented, the change you propose is not substantial but it all depends on the "improvement" you are looking for and of course the budget.

For example, until recently with a Phenom II x4 955 I was well served but for my use the AM3 platform was short in several aspects:

• SATA2
• USB 2.0
• Low/poor performance with SSDs
• Limitation to 16Gb of RAM
• The issue of power consumption was also a problem… although more so the performance per watt

To be honest, I could have gotten an AM3+ motherboard and solved the RAM problems later by getting an FX but it seemed like an absurd expense since it did not satisfy all my requirements... especially the power consumption issue that would worsen with the FX.

That said, it depends on what you want to "improve" ;D

[Fassou]

If you want to hold on to the team a little longer, you can start looking for a Z77 at a good price, while listening to offers for your 2500k and comparing those numbers with putting an i5 Haswell + motherboard, but I wouldn't invest in a k, unless you think about overclocking, because with the turbo I think you'll have more than enough.

And if you don't plan to upgrade memory, I wouldn't spend a dime on it, and save to buy a GTX970 when they go down (<300€).

Salu2!

[rul3s]

Thanks a lot for all the comments, guys!!

Well, I'll be a bit clearer, let's see if you understand my situation jeje :D:

The thing is that an acquaintance liked my pc and wanted one that was the same or similar but without graphics, since he doesn't want it for gaming.
So I offered him my CPU + MOBO + RAM for 275€ (125€ CPU, 75€ MOBO, 50€ RAM) and we'll buy the rest of the parts new (power supply, case, ssd + hd, etc…)

The thing is that he doesn't know how to assemble or install, so for assembling and installing everything I take 100€ more, so if I do this operation, I'll have a total of 375€ to spend on something new without putting in a single € of my own.

That's why the upgrade I want to do, I couldn't do it with the graphics, since it would be 350€ directly from my pocket, I think you already follow what I mean.

So, I get my "old" configuration for 375€ + a few hours of labor, and now what I want is to get something a bit more powerful.

So, I'm considering 2 options, to get something more or less similar:
i5 4690k + Asrock z97 PRO4 + DDR3 2400 2x4GB GSKILL: 398€ (I spend 25€ of my own)
Or something more powerful:
i7 4770K + Asrock z97 Extreme4 + DDR3 2400 2x4GB GSKILL: 508€ (I spend 115€ of my own)

The thing about 16GB of RAM I see it as a crazy thing, I don't think I'll use it for anything right now, and it's 70€ more than what I have as a difference from the i5 to the i7.

Now all the cards are on the table, make your bets, gentlemen!! ;D

P.D: I'm in the middle of university apocalypse right now, so honestly I skip the graphics, for the face of jul'15 then I'll look at the graphics with more eyes :fuckyea:

[Obione]

I would put the motherboard on it and get 1600 memory + this micro: Intel Core i5 2400 3.1Ghz CPU Processor Prozessoren LGA1155 Sandy Bridge 6MB | eBay I would get a Z77 Pro4 for you with your memory and cooler, and a Raijintek for 15 bucks for your colleague. Memory, micro, cooler and your motherboard are less than 300€, the MSI 970 350€ (prices from xtremmedia). You will already be spending money when DDR4 and x6 are at a good price. PD: If you are not going to use the 5850, you will have to get a GPU.

[rul3s]

@Obione:

I would put the motherboard on it and get 1600 MBs and this micro:

Intel Core i5 2400 3.1Ghz CPU Processor Prozessoren LGA1155 Sandy Bridge 6MB | eBay

I would get a Z77 Pro4 for you with your MBs and cooler, and a Raijintek for 15 bucks for your colleague. MBs, CPU, cooler and your motherboard are less than 300€, the MSI 970 350€ (prices from xtremmedia).

You will spend more money when DDR4 and x6 are at a good price.

PD: If you are not going to use the 5850, you will have to get a GPU.

Sorry, right now I have a nVidia GTX660 OC 2GB, I didn't have the signature updated properly :wall:

Changing the motherboard, I would gain 60€ and it would be cheaper for him the 35€ cheaper PC with that CPU, call me weird, but I prefer to stop earning 60€ and put 25€ more of my own and have new shiny hardware waiting for him to touch it jajaja :troll:

[Espinetenbolas]

@Rules:

call me weird, but I'd rather stop earning 60€ and put 25€ more of my own money and have shiny new hardware waiting for me to touch it jajaja :troll:

I understand you perfectly… you'd rather deflower the CPU... naughty :troll:

No seriously, if that's the case now I understand that you want to keep the 8Gb... as for the GPU if you're not going to use it it's not worth investing a euro... in fact bringing one with a relatively good integrated one I would sell the graphics card now you'll still get a good price for it and when you have some money for this purpose get a GPU... well if better and cheaper graphics cards come out your current GPU will also depreciate while if you sell it now what you get now won't lose value... it would be something like freezing the value of your asset, that is if you're not going to put the graphics card in the fridge we'll mess it up

[_Neptunno_]

@Rules:

Oysters many thanks for all the comments guys!!

Well, I'll be a little clearer, let's see if you understand my situation jeje :D:

The thing is that an acquaintance liked my pc and wanted one the same or similar but without graphics, since he doesn't want it for gaming.
So I offered my CPU + VIDEO CARD + RAM for 275€ (125€ CPU, 75€ Video Card, 50€ RAM) and the rest of the pieces we will buy new (power supply, case, ssd + hd, etc…)

The thing is that he doesn't know how to assemble or install, so for assembling and installing everything I take 100€ more, so if I do this operation, I will have a total of 375€ to spend on something new without putting a € of my own.

Hence the change I want to make, I couldn't do it with the graphics card, since it would be 350€ directly from my pocket, I think you already follow what I want to say.

So, I get my "old" configuration for 375€ + a few hours of labor, and now what I want is to get something a little fatter.

So, I'm considering 2 options, to get something more or less similar:
i5 4690k + Asrock z97 PRO4 + DDR3 2400 2x4GB GSKILL: 398€ (I spend 25€ of my own)
Or something more powerful:
i7 4770K + Asrock z97 Extreme4 + DDR3 2400 2x4GB GSKILL: 508€ (I spend 115€ of my own)

The thing about the 16GB of RAM I see it as a madness, I don't think I'll use it for anything right now, and they are 70€ more than what I have of difference from the i5 to the i7.

Now all the cards are on the table, make your bets gentlemen!! ;D

P.D: Now I'm in the middle of the university apocalypse, so honestly I skip the graphics card, for the face of jul'15 then I'll look at the graphics card with more eyes :fuckyea:

Okay, I already understand your change…it's not that the i5 2500k is short for you :troll::troll: The truth is that it's a good opportunity to have something more modern, but note that I don't think you'll notice a substantial improvement, except for looking at the issue of the motherboard…if you're not happy with yours at least you'll lose sight of it.

I would opt for the option I marked in bold, basically because I think you're going to be more than satisfied...I spent the same with the i7 4790k but with the advantage of getting it through work, but I already exceeded my limit that I set, since I was looking at the 4690k...only that I caught it in a moment of madness :ugly:
I can affirm that it goes like a shot in Stock against the I7 950 at the same frequency, and I'm super happy, but surely the i5 would give me the same results in games and normal use.

Regards!!

[Espinetenbolas]

I would leave the first option if you are not going to do OC and the integrated sound card doesn't matter to you.

Otherwise, of the second option, I would discard the 4770K and go directly for the 4790K since the current 4770K hardly overclocks (or so it is said) and although the 4790K is not exactly the panacea, at least you have the 4.4Ghz assured... then the fact that the IHS paste doesn't make good contact is another story ¬¬.

Anyway, check the configurations on Xtremmedia because my second configuration comes out with shipping included and the 4790K for 500.2€ while on Pcomoponentes without shipping it goes to 514.5€... it's not a big difference but it's 14 euros ;D

[rul3s]

They only go up that little bit?? Oh man, my current setup goes up to 4.4 without touching voltages, I with voltages up to 5.3 ghz! Even so, 4.4ghz from this i7 will be better than the 5.3 from my i5, right?
I'm also considering just changing the motherboard… Argg I don't know what to do!

[Espinetenbolas]

@Rules:

Do they really only go up that little bit?? Wow, my current setup goes up to 4.4 without touching voltages, I with voltages up to 5.3 ghz! Even so, 4.4ghz of this i7 will be better than the 5.3 of my i5, right?

Well, the performance per cycle of Haswell is better whether we're talking about an i5 or an i7, not in everything but in most things although the technology is intelcore and the architecture has been improved in many things and new instructions have been added. Then there's the HT issue that simulates having 4 more cores (4 real + 4 virtual) and that multitasking applications give approximately 50% more performance... it would be like having a hexacore i5.

As for OC I say the 4.4 because that's what it comes with... the normal thing is to be able to put it at 4.6-4.7... mine does it without hardly touching voltage but you put LINX on it and it screws up because it goes over 100º... in fact I passed the superpi 32M at 5Ghz by air with barely 1.325V and I've raised it to 5.1-5.2 without being able to validate SPi... and the problem is the TIM between DIE and IHS which leaves too much thickness so I'll be forced if I want to crank it up to "open up" the micro... it all comes in this post: OC a un 4790K - HardLimit

The 2500K doesn't have that TIM problem because the DIE and the IHS are soldered.

You can see the "opening up" issue with data in this forum: [Official] Delidded Club / Guide where you can compare the margin of improvement very well... and here the margin of OC of the Devil's Canyon: The Intel Devil's Canyon Owners Club

[rul3s]

@Espinetenbolas:

Let's see, the performance per cycle of Haswell is better both if we talk about an i5 or an i7, not in everything but in most things although the technology is intelcore the architecture has been improved in many things and new instructions have been added. Then there is the issue of HT that simulates having 4 more cores (4 real + 4 virtual) and that multitasking applications give approximately 50% more performance... let's say it would be like having a hexacore i5.

Regarding OC I say the 4,4 because it's what it comes with... the normal thing is to be able to put it at 4,6-4,7... mine does it without hardly touching voltage but you put LINX and it screws up because it goes over 100º... in fact I passed the superpi 32M at 5Ghz by air with barely 1.325V and I raised it to 5.1-5.2 without being able to validate SPi... and the problem is the TIM between DIE and IHS that leaves too much thickness so I will be forced if I want to put some fire to "open up" the micro... it all comes in this post: OC a un 4790K - HardLimit

The 2500K doesn't have this TIM problem because the DIE and the IHS are soldered.

The issue of "opening up" can be seen with data in this forum: [Official] Delidded Club / Guide where you can compare the margin of improvement very well... and here the margin of OC of the Devil's Canyon: The Intel Devil's Canyon Owners Club

Many thanks espinete! I leave you a few positive points that you have earned, and because I can't send you uans

I'll tell you what I've decided, it will be in 2 exams I'm in full exams and with almost no time :mudo:

[rul3s]

@Rules:

Many thanks espinete! I leave you a few positive points that you have earned, and because I can't send you uans

I will tell you what I have decided, which will be in 2 exams. I am in the middle of exams and have almost no time :mudo:

I meant weeks… you can already imagine how I'm going... xd :wall: :ugly:

[rul3s]

Just a quick thing,

I've noticed that CPUs have gone up quite a bit in price in about 2 weeks, about 20€ each, both the 4690K and the 4790K, do you know if it's for some reason, for example, that they have fixed the IHS issue?

I say this because if it's a new revision I'll get the new one, whether it's from one or the other, if it's been a price increase just because, I'll take advantage to buy it NOW before they raise the price also at CoolMod (292€ vs 309€ from pccomponentes)

New revision or prices adapting to the holiday season?

[whoololon]

But let's see, what are you really going to use the machine for?
What are you going to put into it that won't just run on a more powerful graphics card?