2 graphics cards for 2 PCs

[SGAN]

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Tengo las siguientes máquinas, y aunque me planteé cambiar la placa y RAM de una de ellas (y de paso ampliar la RAM), creo que me quedo como estoy, ya con 4GB de RAM por máquina, de momento creo que tengo suficiente y tengo máquinas perfectamente válidas en conjunto:

Explico un poco… los equipos que remodelaría un poco son los siguientes, quiero cambiarles la gráfica. Hay otros equipos en casa, uno es bastante viejete, y otro es un AthlonX2 Kuma 7750, que no voy a invertir dinero en él

CPU: AMD PhenomII 965 (x4) @3.7Ghz
Disipador Thermaltake Frío
Placa Base: ASRock A770DE Chipset AMD 770 + SB700
Memoria: 4GB (2x2) DDR2 1066Mhz Kingston HyperX
Disco(s) duro(s): 1TB SATA + 40GB 5400rpm ATA
Gráfica: ATi Radeon 4850X2 2GB (Sapphire) (jodida, momentaneamente una Radeon X850XT Platinum Edition 256MB no puedo jugar a casi nada )
Sonido: Sound Blaster Audigy 2 ZS
Fuente de alimentación: Nox Urano 700w
Caja: Thermaltake Strike MX

PC 2:

CPU: AMD AthlonII 620 (x4) @3.3Ghz
Disipador: Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus
Placa Base: ASRock A770DE+ Chipset AMD 770 + SB710
Memoria: 4GB (2x2) DDR2 1066Mhz Kingston HyperX
Disco(s) duro(s): 250GB SATA + 200GB SATA + 200GB 7200rpm ATA
Gráfica: ATi Radeon 5770 1GB (PowerColor) (también caput, era una refurbished, y salío fatal, comprada en, no vuelvo a comprar refurbished, mientras tanto una 4770 512MB)
Sonido: Sound Blaster Live! 5.1 (a veces solo se oye un lado, no sé porque, de momento uso la Integrada)
Fuente de alimentación: LCPower 600W
Caja: Nox NX-1 Evo Pure Black Edition

El presupuesto que tengo para las 2 gráficas es 300€ (envío incluido, es decir, 150€ por gráfica), ni un € más, podría ser quizá 301 o 302€ pero ya sería ajustar demasiado. Tengo un límite que depende mi tarjeta de crédito, que es extrajera, el límite por tanto, no depende de mí. La divisa con la que trabaja mi tarjeta es USA $, así que tengo que tener MUCHO cuidado hasta con el último €, porque las conversiones pueden variar diariamente y el límite real que tengo disponible es de 305€ al cambio actual (prefiero rondar 300€ o menos, si me paso, me permiten pagar, pero tengo penalizaciones). Esto en principio no le importa a nadie, pero lo aclaro para que nadie me diga cosas como "por 5€ más, o por 10€ más, o por 3€ más"…

PCComponentes, no sé por qué, no me acepta esa tarjeta (a pesar de ser una Master Card), cuando compro ahí, uso una tarjeta española, pero no es el caso, sé que Alternate me la acepta perfectamente, lo mismo que Pixmania (pero en Pixmania no compro ni loco), al igual que todas las tiendas británicas que he probado. En 4Frags nunca lo he intentado, así que no sé.

No quiero Pixmania porque tuve una muy mala experiencia con mi 4850X2 comprada ahí, no se hicieron cargo de la devolución, me dieron largas, etc, al final se me pasó el tiempo de garantía con tanta mierda, y ya cuando la recibí, la caja no estaba en muy buen estado (olía a que era de un RMA, o algo así), pero al principio no me importó mucho. Tampoco quiero "refurbished", la 5770 que se me estropeó, era refurbished, y me fue mal desde el primera día, ++++ Editado por Cobra ++++

Modelos que he visto en mis posibilidades:

nVidia GTX 650 Ti:

Zotac (de referencia)
ZOTAC Geforce GTX 650 Ti

KFA2 (966 MHz Core, memorias referencia 5400Mhz)
KFA2 Geforce GTX 650 Ti EX OC

Gigabyte (1032Mhz Core, memorias referencia 5400Mhz)
GIGABYTE GV-N65TOC-1GI

MSI (954Mhz GPU, memorias de referencia)
MSI GeForce GTX 650 Ti 1GB OC

Gainward Golden Sample (1006Mhz, memorias 5500Mhz)
Gainward GeForce GTX 650 Ti "Golden Sample" 1GB, GeForce GTX 650 Ti, NVIDIA, 1006 MHz, 1024 MB, GDDR5-SDRAM, 128 Bit: Amazon.es: Electrónica

Sparkle (referencia, 133.89€ envío incluído con Super Free Delivery)
Sparkle NVIDIA GeForce GTX650TI Graphic Card (1GB GDDR5 128Bit, PCI-Express 3.0, HDMI, 2 X DVI, NVIDIA 3D Vision Ready): Amazon.co.uk: Computers & Accessories

Palit (referencia, 133.89€ envío incluido)
Palit GeForce GTX 650 Ti Nvidia Graphics Card (1GB GDDR5, PCI Express 3.0, Mini HDMI, DVI, VGA, Kepler GPU Architecture, NVIDIA 3D Vision Ready): Amazon.co.uk: Computers & Accessories

Palit OC Edtion (1006Mhz Core, memorias 5500Mhz, 139.738€ envío incluido)
Palit GeForce GTX 650 Ti Nvidia OC Edition Graphics Card (1GB GDDR5, PCI Express 3.0, Mini HDMI, DVI, VGA, Kepler GPU Architecture, NVIDIA 3D Vision Ready): Amazon.co.uk: Computers & Accessories
http://www.palit.biz/palit/vgapro.php?id=2059

ATi/AMD 7770:

Asus (Referencia)
ASUS HD7770-1GD5

Asus Direct Cu2 (PCB largo, velocidades de referencia)
ASUS Radeon HD 7770 DirectCU V2
(Una 7770 de PCB largo, no sé que versiones son mejores, las de PCB largo o corto)

PowerColor (1150Mhz Core, 5000Mhz Memorias)
PowerColor Radeon HD 7770 PCS+
(La marca que menos me gusta, pero la más overclockeada de fábrica)
Power color no me gustan mucho, pero las versiones PCS+ de sus diferentes tarjetas, suelen tener buenas reviews en diversas páginas extranjeras, lo que me hace planteármelas.

MSI (referencia, 114.245€ con el envío incluido)
MSI AMD R7770 1GB DDR5 PCI-E Graphics Card: Amazon.co.uk: Computers & Accessories

En principio, en cuanto a rendimiento, tengo preferencia por las GTX650 Ti, por que creo que rinden más, aunque no lo tengo muy claro).
De las AMD, me interesa que son suficientemente buenas, y que mis placas tienen soporte Crossfire, lo que quizá, me permitiría, el día de mañana, comprar una nueva gráfica potente, y poner las 2 AMD en CFx (aunque el soporte CFx de mis placas es muy limitado, se recomienda como máximo CFx de 4670, pero leí en algún sitio casos de CFx con tarjetas más potentes, como las 5770, y aunque rendían menos que CFx en otras placas, funcionaban).

Alguna recomendación? alguna aclaración? miré bastante, y tengo alguna idea de que me puede interesar, pero me interesa saber consejos opiniones, de si elegir en este caso AMD o nVidia, marcas o modelos concretos de tarjetas, algunas reviews aclaratorias, alguna idea de precios más asequibles que me permitan optar a algo mejor, o tiendas donde poder intentar comprar online, etc…

No puedo comprar de 2ª mano, ni en tiendas físicas.

Saludos!!!

[Franziskaner]

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Por que no te planteas una 660 OC y un más barata , no creo que juegues con los dos pcs , no?
Saludos

[SGAN]

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Ya, pero mi hermano si juega a la misma vez que yo …

Siempre he comprado una mejor y otra peor para mi hermano, pero esta vez, ya va siendo hora de repartir las cosas de forma más equitativa, ya tiene 19 años, así que considero que ya debe empezar a notar cosas que con 14/15 años no notaba antes mientras tirase un juego, suficiente, ahora debería percatarse de ciertas diferencias, o al menos eso espero y quiero

[Franziskaner]

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entonces solo falta un dato :troll: a que jugáis?
saludos

[SGAN]

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A todo, al PC, a la XBox360, a la Wii, a la Cube, a la PS2, a la PSX, a la XBox, etc…

Jugamos a juegos de estrategia, a FPS's, a juegos de ROL Online, Aventuras y juegos de acción (1ª y tercera persona, vista cenital, etc), aventuras gráficas, juegos de ROL occidentales y japoneses, etc. No hacemos ascos a muchas cosas... lo que menos, los de coches, pero el en consola el Forza, y Mario Kart, y en PC, el GRID, los Colin McRae y poco más.

Lo que más jugamos últimamente es al League of Legends (los 2), que no requiere mucho (me funciona más o menos con la Radeon X850XT 256MB que estoy usando provisionalmente), y mi hermano está enganchado al The War Z (juego se supervivencia online, de Zombies) y al Guildwars 2.

[ferelxyx]

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Sapphire Radeon HD 7770 Vapor-X GHz Edition OC 1GB GDDR5 - 143 euros - la mejor opcion en general, tiene O.C. de fabrica buen disipador y no da problemas con los juegos ( aqui esta algo cara )
en PcComponentes cuesta 121 euros

ZOTAC Geforce GTX 650 Ti - 133 euros - la segunda opcion, pues da problemas con algunos juegos

saludos

[SGAN]

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Como que da problemas?

Las GTX 650Ti dan problemas en juegos? no me digas eso!

[SGAN]

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Por cierto, no tiene que ver, pero como agradecimiento por la ayuda prestada a todosl os que entren, pues, por si alguien no lo sabe, os informo que metro 2033 está gratis a través de Steam… no sé por cuanto tiempo.

Dame-Linux: Metro 2033 Gratis para Windows (Steam)

[Franziskaner]

@SGAN:

By the way, it has nothing to do, but as a thank you for the help provided to all those who enter, well, in case someone doesn't know, I inform you that Metro 2033 is free through Steam... I don't know for how long.

Dame-Linux: Metro 2033 Free for Windows (Steam)

thanks but......
Game Deals - Page 6 - HardLimit
regards

[SGAN]

Or, sorry, anyway, the Metro offer is over...

On the other hand SHIT!!!!!.... a question, I was looking at the MSI Cyclone II (GTX 650 Ti)... and the Review says it's not compatible with SLi!!!!!... only that model? or none of the GTX 650 Ti is compatible with Sli???? if some are compatible and others are not, I'll have to be careful, or go back to my original idea of going for the Radeon 7770...

Let's see if someone can clarify that doubt for me.

Regards...

[ferelxyx]

no GTX 650 Ti is compatible with SLI and with filters activated at high resolution the screen goes black and does not use all the graphics memory
in short, the classic refurbished NVIDIA, another chestnut for the group

if you get the 6870 or a GTX 560 it is still a better option for performance

regards

[SGAN]

The thing about previous generation cards... well, the truth is no, I want new ones, even if it means less performance (that is, I prefer a 7770 over a 5850/6850, for example)... the reason is easy... first, the power consumption (since my last 4850X2, power consumption has become something important to consider, at least), and second... although the 7770 performs less, the difference is not overwhelming, although in some specific cases it may be noticeable, in most cases it's not a big deal, however, what is likely is that within 2 generations AMD will stop providing continuous driver support for the 6 series, while the 7 series will continue to have it...

It's what's usually common... for example, right now, there's no constant support for the 4 series... and yet my 4770 performs a notch better than a 6670 (the recommended for low-end ranges)... the only problem? that I have to wait longer for driver updates...

A driver update, in life, will not mean more performance for the 4000 series at this point, but it may solve compatibility issues with some new game that comes out

And I don't change graphics every generation, I change graphics every 2/3 generations (before I changed every generation or more than once per generation, but those were other times )

Now what interests me!!!!

What can I say? you've taken away my desire to return to nVidia with "0 coma" (that's Spanish for "zero point zero")... I had Radeon 9700 Pro / 9800 and was with nVidia from GF3 to GF4 Ti4600, before that with 3Dfx)… I thought it would be this generation, but I see that it's not going to be.

The problem of the lack of SLI support and what you tell me about the problems with filters and high resolutions (although this is not something I think I would use in principle), throws me back in one fell swoop, despite performing better than the 7770.

Although you may not believe it, the lack of SLI support throws me back even more than the problem of high resolutions + filters... since it's not a graphics card for using high resolutions with filters in games...

QUESTION: Is it the same if it's an old game? I don't know, like.... hmmm... Prey or Bioshock if I put them at those resolutions with filters? or only with those that are more demanding for the graphics?

Greetings!

[ferelxyx]

Well, don't complicate your life

SAPPHIRE Vapor-X HD 7770 GHz Edition OC 1GB GDDR5 - 143 euros

clock speed 1150 MHz
stream processors 640
shader model 5.0
DirectX version 11.1
OpenGl version 4.2
memory 1024 MB GDDR5 at 5000 MHz

Connections
HDMI
DisplayPort 1
DVI-I 1
DVD-D 1

[Sylver]

@SGAN:

The thing with previous-generation cards… well, the truth is no, I want the new ones, even if it means less performance (that is, I'd rather have a 7770 than a 5850/6850, for example)... the reason is easy... first, the power consumption (since my last 4850X2, power consumption has become something important, to be taken into account, at least), and second... even though the 7770 performs less, the difference is not overwhelming, although in some specific cases it may be noticeable, in most cases it's not a big deal, however, what is likely is that within 2 generations AMD will stop providing continuous driver support for the 6 series, while the 7 series will still have it...

1st- If you intend to skimp on the power supply by using a card that consumes less, I see it as a dangerous inconsistency… Something to reconsider a lot.

2nd- The performance difference exists, and sometimes like the 5850 vs. 7770, it's almost half the performance. And with the 6870 more, and if it were a 6950 don't even get me started... I repeat: Something to reconsider a lot.

3rd- The fact that AMD will stop providing continuous support for the 6 series and other cards of similar age... as you say, it's only likely, and I who don't believe it, basically because if operating systems continue to come out, they will continue to develop software for their products, updated for the new operating systems. Another thing is that you want to hold onto the card until the year 2174, which I see as less likely than the fact that support will disappear...

In conclusion: Something to reconsider a lot.

Regards

[Franziskaner]

+1 NEVER SAID IT BETTER :ugly:
Regards

[SGAN]

@Sylver:

1º- If you intend to skimp on the power supply by using a graphics card that consumes less, I see an inconsistency that is worth worrying about… It's something to think about.

2º- There is a difference in performance, and sometimes like the 5850 vs. the 7770, it's almost half the performance. And with the 6870 more, and if it were a 6950, I wouldn't even mention it... I repeat: It's something to think about.

3º- The fact that AMD stops providing continuous support for the 6 series and others of similar age... as you say, it's only probable, and I don't believe it, basically because if they continue to release operating systems, they will continue to develop software for their products, updated for new operating systems. Another thing is if you want to hold onto the graphics card until the year 2174, which I see as less likely than the fact that support will disappear...

In conclusion: It's something to think about.

Regards

1º Let's see, if I said I have a 4850X2, it's because I don't have many power supply problems, right?… Where I want to skimp is on the electricity bill, and that's why I'm reducing all the consumption in my house. If you now tell me that the graphics card doesn't consume, then I stop reading... if I could, the next thing would be to get rid of my PhenomII 965 140W... but I can't.

2º Okay, pay for 2 6950s and I'll tell you the difference, remember I need 2 graphics cards, because the 4770 will go to another PC... and no, the 7770 holds its own well against the 6850, which I remember performs less than the 5850 (which are almost clones, except in brute force). That the 7770 performs less, yes, but the performance difference isn't overwhelming. I have a 4850X2 that with Crossfire activated, in the games that support it, performs similar to the 5850, a little less. However, the difference in consumption in favor of the 7770 is more than considerable compared to the 5850, the 6850, and don't even mention my 4850X2. Moreover, many of you, when you look at the overall performance of several GPUs, get obsessed, and don't focus on the details. If you looked a little more closely, you would realize that the newer the game, the shorter the performance difference between a 7770 and a 6850... in some cases it's not met, but it's the general trend... the most obvious case is comparing it with Crysis 1, where the 6850 sweeps the floor with the 7770, however, in Crysis 2, the 7770 does the same with the 6850...

3º Let's see, I've been in these topics for many years, and yes... they do stop giving "continuous support" to cards that are 3 generations old... in the past, it made more or less sense, generations varied quite a lot, and new OpenGL and DirectX libraries were taken advantage of more, but a certain retrocompatibility was maintained for a long time as well...

That is, the idea of stopping support with that temporal reference is fulfilled. Hardware companies have always done this... when something happens always, it is assumed that, most likely, it will continue to happen, it is called deduction by induction. What you believe, little or nothing matters, I have a 90% chance of being right, and you have a 10% chance, which leads me to follow my assumption instead of yours, despite the fact that I could be wrong.

That lack of support, in the past, made a lot of sense, there were more or less big technological leaps... but tell me today if a 4870, 4850 or 4770 still doesn't fulfill its function? (not for someone demanding or for high performance, but enough to run a game at certain levels) besides, they are DX 10.1 cards... and no, I'm not going to hold onto a graphics card for 500 years, but I'm also not willing to change it every year, or every 2... I change it when I CONSIDER that, for my needs, it doesn't move correctly something I'm interested in moving. Period! and I'm not going to ask for your opinion on that.

I remind you that currently, most of the gaming software is DX 10, most still backward compatible with DX 9, and DX 11 software is marginal in proportion, and yet they have already stopped giving support.

P.D.: "Inconcluencia" doesn't exist in my vocabulary... nor in the Spanish vocabulary... not even in the so-called colloquial language, nor in any jargon or argot.

EDIT: The problem of support is a problem present in many markets, not just in hardware, I suppose you've heard the term (very fashionable) of programmed obsolescence, right?

[Sylver]

@SGAN:

1º Vamos a ver, si he dicho que tengo una 4850X2, será que muchos problemas de fuente no tengo no?… donde quiero racanear, es en la factura de la luz, y por eso estoy reduciendo todo el consumo de mi casa. Si ahora me dices que la gráfica no consume, entonces dejo de leer... si pudiera lo próximo sería deshacerme de mi PhenomII 965 140W... pero no puedo.

2º Vale, págame tú 2 6950 y te comento la diferencia que hay, te recuerdo que necesito 2 gráficas, pues la 4770 irá a otro PC... y no, la 7770 aguanta bien el tipo ante la 6850, que te recuerdo rinde menos que la 5850 (que estas si son casi clónicas, excepto en potencia bruta). Que la 7770 rinde menos, si, pero la diferencia de rendimiento no es apabullante. Yo tengo una 4850X2 que con el Crossfire activado, en los juegos que lo admite, rinde similar a la 5850, un poco menos. Sin embargo la diferencia de consumo a favor de la 7770, es más que considerable con respecto a la 5850, a la 6850, y no hablemos ya de mi 4850X2. Además, muchos de vosotros, cuando miráis los rendimientos en general de varias GPU's os obcecáis, y no os fijáis en los detalles, si te fijaras un poco más, te darías cuenta de que cuando más nuevo es el juego más se acorta la diferencia de rendimiento entre una 7770 y una 6850... en algunos casos no se cumple, pero es la tónica general... el caso más evidente es compararla con el Crysis 1, donde la 6850 barre el suelo con la 7770, sin embargo, en el Crysis 2, la 7770 hace lo propio con la 6850...

3º Vamos a ver, llevo muchos años en estos temas, y sí... sí que se deja de dar "soporte continuado" a las tarjetas de 3 generaciones atrás... antiguamente tenía, más o menos, sentido, las generaciones variaban bastante, y se aprovechaban más las nuevas librerías OpenGL y DirectX que iban saliendo, pero se mantenía cierta retrocompatibilidad por un largo tiempo también...

Vamos, que lo de dejar de dar soporte con esa referencia temporal, se cumple. Las compañias de hardware lo vienen haciendo siempre... cuando algo ocurre siempre, se presupone que, lo más probable, es que siga ocurriendo, se denomina deducción por inducción. Lo que tú creas, poco o nada importa, yo tengo un 90% de posibilidades de tener razón, y tú tienes un 10% de probabilidades, lo que me lleva a seguir mi suposición en lugar de la tuya, a pesar de poder estar equivocado.

Esa falta de soporte, antiguamente tenía mucho sentido, había saltos tecnológicos más o menos grandes... pero dime tú hoy en día si una 4870, 4850 o 4770 no cumplen aun su función? (no para alguien exigente ni para altos rendimientos, pero sí lo suficiente para mover un juego a ciertos niveles) además son tarjetas DX 10.1... y no, no voy a aguantar una gráfica 500 años, pero tampoco estoy dispuesto a cambiarla cada año, o cada 2... la cambio cuando YO CONSIDERE, que para mis exigencias, no mueva correctamente algo que me interese mover. Punto! y no te voy a pedir a tí tu opinión para eso.

Te recuerdo que actualmente, la mayor parte del software lúdico es DX 10, la mayoría aun retrocompatibles con DX 9, y el software DX 11 es marginal en proporción, y sin embargo ya dejaron de darle soporte.

PD: "Incongruencia" no existe en mi vocabulario... ni tampoco en el vocabulario español... ni siquiera en el denominado lenguaje coloquial, ni en ninguna jerga o argot.

EDITO: EL problema del soporte, es un problema presente en muchísimos mercados, no solo en el hardware, supongo que habrás escuchado el término (muy de moda), de obsolescencia programada, no?

Bueno compañero, y si tan claro lo tienes, ¿por qué vienes a pedir opinión? Dado que tienes todas las bases fijadas, tu opinión y experiencia bien forjadas, y el conocimiento acerca de los diversos rendimientos, consumos y compatibilidades tan abultado, se me antoja innecesaria toda esta discusión. Sobre todo teniendo en cuenta tu afirmación acerca de que "mi opinión poco o nada importa". No obstante, respondo:

Si eres gamer, eres gamer. Los juegos seguirán saliendo, y necesitando más y más rendimiento en materia de hardware. Si te ofendes al leer que hay gráficas antiguas que mejoran (y seguirán mejorando) el rendimiento de algunas actuales, siendo por ello más caras, no es algo que sea culpa de quien por aquí aporte su opinión. Pero ni eso, ni que el soporte vaya a desaparecer antes o después. Pasarán los años y lo viejo irá desapareciendo, pero tú mismo sabrás hasta dónde ha de aguantar una tarjeta gráfica, o el componente que sea destinado a la función que sea, no tiene sentido pillarse un rebote porque te comenten que el soporte se mantendrá más o menos años de los que a ti te interesan, nadie lo sabe con exactitud. Y sobre los posibles porcentajes de razón, tú mismo hablas de presuponer, y yo tengo gráficas de hace 7 años con soporte para sistemas operativos actuales, tú verás. No quiere decir que eso siga ocurriendo tal y como funcionan ahora las cosas, pero ya son ejemplos a tener en cuenta.
En resumen, si te molesta que en un foro te digan que "es para replanteárselo mucho", apaga y vámonos… o pregunta en otro sitio.

Aclaro: Puedo tener más o menos idea que muchos de los aquí registrados, pero te aseguro que siempre escribo con conocimiento de causa. Si no es lo que querías leer, debiste sopesar antes de abrir la rama que podrías recibir opiniones discordantes con tus intereses o preferencias.

PD: Perdón por el término "inconcluencia", a toda vista inexistente. Me suele pasar mucho, como con vocablos como "jurisdicción". Mea culpa.

PD2: Tranquilo, sé de sobra lo que es la obsolescencia programada... Lo he sufrido en primera persona.

Saludos

[amd125]

SGAN, first of all, stay calm, they are just trying to help you by giving alternatives, it's not necessary to make certain types of comments.

Regarding the graphics, personally I don't recommend the Ati 7770 because I think that for what it performs, the price is somewhat inflated. I prefer my graphics to that, and about two years ago it cost €90, it would be the Reburbised but that's it.

I know you care a lot about consumption, but if you have to pay €130-140 for the 7770, I'd rather stretch for the 7850 even if it's only one Giga, but for the difference I would go for the 2.

You should see the consumption in Idle depending on the hours a day you have the computer on, and above all, of those hours, how many you play and how many you don't.

If finally the consumption is so decisive, then it's not a bad option, but it's also difficult to have everything in a PC. We can't try to have a Gamer team with low consumption. If you want a balanced team, the Ati 7770 can be good for you, but I wouldn't spend that money on a graphics card that in not much time will have problems to move games to Full HD.

With my graphics card, I don't care, my current resolution is 1280*1024 and I play everything at high without problems with the company's equipment, but depending on the resolution you want to play, know that the 7770 in Full HD won't have a very long life span. That's why I don't see spending that money on that graphics card.

Best regards.

[Gaiteiro]

@SGAN:

1º Let's see, if I said I have a 4850X2, it means I don't have many power supply problems, right?… where I want to be frugal is in the electricity bill, and that's why I'm reducing all the consumption in my house. If you tell me now that the graphics card doesn't consume, then I stop reading... if I could, the next thing would be to get rid of my PhenomII 965 140W... but I can't.

2º Okay, pay for 2 6950s and I'll tell you the difference, remember I need 2 graphics cards, because the 4770 will go to another PC... and no, the 7770 holds its own well against the 6850, which I remind you performs less than the 5850 (which are almost clones, except in brute force). The 7770 performs less, yes, but the performance difference is not overwhelming. I have a 4850X2 that with Crossfire activated, in games that support it, performs similar to the 5850, a little less. However, the difference in consumption in favor of the 7770 is more than considerable compared to the 5850, the 6850, and let's not talk about my 4850X2. Moreover, many of you, when you look at the overall performance of several GPUs, get obsessed, and you don't look at the details, if you looked a little more, you would realize that the newer the game is, the shorter the performance difference between a 7770 and a 6850... in some cases it's not met, but it's the general trend... the most evident case is comparing it with Crysis 1, where the 6850 sweeps the floor with the 7770, however, in Crysis 2, the 7770 does the same with the 6850...

3º Let's see, I've been in these topics for many years, and yes... they do stop giving "continued support" to cards 3 generations behind... in the past, it made more or less sense, generations varied quite a lot, and new OpenGL and DirectX libraries were better utilized, but a certain retrocompatibility was maintained for a long time as well...

That is, the idea of stopping support with that time reference is fulfilled. Hardware companies have always done this... when something always happens, it is assumed that, most likely, it will continue to happen, it is called deduction by induction. What you believe, little or nothing matters, I have a 90% chance of being right, and you have a 10% chance, which leads me to follow my assumption instead of yours, despite the possibility of being wrong.

That lack of support, in the past, made a lot of sense, there were more or less big technological leaps... but tell me today if a 4870, 4850 or 4770 doesn't still fulfill its function? (not for someone demanding or for high performance, but enough to run a game at certain levels) besides, they are DX 10.1 cards... and no, I'm not going to keep a graphics card for 500 years, but I'm also not willing to change it every year, or every 2... I change it when I CONSIDER that, for my needs, it doesn't move correctly something I'm interested in moving. Period! and I'm not going to ask for your opinion for that.

I remind you that currently, most of the gaming software is DX 10, most still backward compatible with DX 9, and DX 11 software is marginal in proportion, and yet they stopped giving support.

PD: "Inconclusiveness" does not exist in my vocabulary... nor in the Spanish vocabulary... not even in the so-called colloquial language, nor in any jargon or argot.

EDITO: The problem of support is a present problem in many markets, not just in hardware, I suppose you have heard the term (very fashionable) of programmed obsolescence, right?

I was going to enter to give my opinion but, well, I see that you have it perfectly clear, you don't need any kind of advice or opinion.
Regards.

[Fassou]

Either you rephrase the initial question, to focus on the doubt you have and stop giving sermons, or I delete the post :osvaisacagar: Salu2!