"For us to use our mobile phones, people have to die"

[Kernel1.0]

The truth is that this is no longer news, but it is always good to remember it.
I leave here a reading about the coltan war for those who do not know what it is about.
'For us to use our mobile phone, people have to die' | Solidarity | elmundo.es
Recycle, reuse and think about it before changing hardware on a whim.

[amd125]

I had already read the article and I find it very interesting. At least I try to recycle what I can and honestly I get fewer hot flashes from buying hardware. But the issue of inequalities is a complex one. I worked for a little over a year and a half at a foundation and you realize that there are always people willing to help, but there are many interests in that many countries do not get ahead. So that a few of us can live well in the first world, many people have to go through hardships.

[Obione]

If you could see my Motorola… It has even lost its chrome.

The problem is that the world is so fucked up that we can only patch it up :ffu:

[cobito]

I find that an extremely sensationalist statement. The story of coltan is like so many others where the material well-being of Westerners is achieved through the exploitation and suffering of many non-Westerners.

The truth is that I am a bit tired of the moralistic refrain of "hey, for you to have this, someone else has had to suffer/die". It seems that because I consume electronic products, products manufactured in China, oil, etc., I am a horrible person because these are products that I can only have if there are those who suffer or die.

The statement should not be "For us to use our mobile phone, people have to die". It should be "For mobile phone manufacturers to obtain obscene profits, people have to die". Because research into alternative materials or control by companies that acquire this material would end the problem in one fell swoop. The problem is that this is not profitable (or not as profitable).

When I go to buy a mobile phone, a laptop or I put petrol in my car, what I am doing is following the necessary guidelines to live in this system. Some may not, but most people need to get to their jobs by car/bus/metro, they need a computer to work or a mobile phone to stay in touch with customers. So why does someone have to come and tell me that because I use these products, people are dying? What am I supposed to do, live on the fringes of society, move under a bridge, shoot myself…?

I really do not know to what extent it is in my hands to change this situation. If there were "fair trade" style electronic products and instead of acquiring human rights-friendly products (more expensive), I acquired products of dubious origin (cheaper), then in that case it would be acceptable for someone to come and question my morality.

But if there is no other option, the system in which I live forces me to acquire these products for my survival and the power to change things is far from being in my hands, I do not find it at all reasonable for someone to come and tell me "That mobile phone you have is because someone has died".

It is important to make known the situation and where the products we consume come from. And surely that newspaper needs to come up with a sensationalist headline to sell more copies (because that is what it lives on), but I do not accept that kind of moral lesson.

[Tecnho]

The same old and overly controversial topic.

I'm not going to get into a debate about something I don't know, but it's clear that there's crap everywhere and we're not going to solve anything by stopping to consume products made in countries that claim to be exploited, but what really bothers me is the hypocrisy that surrounds this, people who protest and then carry iphones 5 or like the ones from greenpeace who buy shares of shell (to force green actions they say) anyway a thousand things that we don't know and all very moralistic but I see too much hypocrisy.
Everyone should clean up their own house.

[ferelxyx]

if we are going to pay attention to all these issues, we could not live
we already have the problem of corruption in all sectors and the politician is the worst
and no one does or can do anything to remove those thieves from power, who only promise lies
and then they lower your pants and give you a blowjob

i lost two jobs i had because of the people currently in power, and i thank them
so i am at home touching my balls and without a cent

regards

[Obione]

It could be worse, my current data protection job is costing me money. I have paid more in self-employment taxes than I have collected in invoices :ugly: Getting back to the topic, I have a clear conscience. I recycle paper and cardboard, separate containers, and take hazardous waste to the ecopark :fuckyea: If I were a billionaire, I would build 3 circuits: Spa, Nurburgring and Suzuka. I would also get myself a few cars, even a single-seater :troll: If I had money left over, I would give it to Africa.

[Yorus]

These are the pros and cons of the aggressive capitalist system in which we live, a spiral of consumption that we cannot stop and that if we stop it leads us to ruin, and we have the example in the current state of the economy.

In order for people to have work, we have to sell, and in order to sell, we also have to consume, and if this vicious circle stops somewhere, we all derail and go from being people with two cars, three computers, an apartment on the beach and many appliances that give us more than we need to being unemployed and prostituting ourselves in order to be able to get by, feed our children or pay for a good education for them. We go from opulence to having no place within this market economy.

I think it's all nonsense, a noose that we have put around our own necks or that, rather, others have put on us to fill their pockets in such a way that with other ways of living it would be unthinkable. Many of these people also don't care that their products are made by children, people in Africa for a bowl of food or whatever, because they look the other way and only see money.

I love computers, cars, big TVs... technology in general, but perhaps the world in general would be happier with a less aggressive economy, perhaps with a somewhat slower pace, and where money would not go mostly to a few pockets, but to what really makes us evolve, like science, health, education...

Here's a chat to start the afternoon :troll:

[Kernel1.0]

No, here no one has said (in the article it is commented) that it is directly the fault of coltan, the headline is to attract attention to the conflict, it is an ethnic war and they will continue to massacre, rape and kidnap the same with coltan or without it. In this conflict it happens as in so many others in which the UN would have to intervene to protect the civilians since the government of the country cannot do anything or worse if it can but does not want to, because they take part of the profits in rich bribes, but of course the UN has been nothing more than a decorative piece for many years or to get some resolution legitimizing to… we already know who.
The added thing is that behind the tragedy are some companies and countries turning a blind eye to extract metals at low cost, that is what is shocking, but here nothing happens.

[Yorus]

@Kernel1.0:

No, no one here has said (in the article it is commented) that it is directly the coltan's fault, the headline is to attract attention to the conflict, it is an ethnic war and they will continue to massacre, rape and kidnap the same with coltan or without it. In this conflict it happens as in so many others in which the UN would have to intervene to protect the civilians since the government of the country cannot do anything or worse if it can but does not want to, because they take part of the profits in rich bribes, but of course the UN has been nothing but a decorative piece for many years or to get some resolution legitimizing to… we already know who.
The addition is that behind the tragedy are some companies and countries turning a blind eye to extract metals at low cost, that is what is shocking, but here nothing happens.

It sells more the theme of invading Islamic countries for oil, but certainly Africa is full of similar cases that we often do not even know about. A disgusting world, yes.

[Fassou]

Bueno Sres., vayan terminando que ya saben lo que reza el apartado 3.3 de las normas.
@Normas:

3.3. No se permiten mensajes relacionados con temás políticos y/o religiosos.
No están permitidos los mensajes relacionados con temas políticos de cualquier índole. Nuestra experiencia ha demostrado que la publicación de este tipo de temas solo conlleva a discusiones y tensiones inútiles entre usuarios y por lo tanto eliminaremos cualquier mensaje relacionado con ellos.

Salu2!

[Sylver]

We must start from the base that corruption does not exist, it is that the system works this way, without more, from a long time ago, one only has to review history and investigate a little, everything has a reason. We agree that there are people of good soul who if they could, would make a better world, putting their will and looking out for common interests, who does not know someone? Right after thinking about them, we realize why they are not governing… why they do not go up... They simply will never get to the top, there will always be a lot of power above, and the interest that surrounds that power is to stay in charge, controlling everything.
Knowing this, we also know that we must start from the fact that money moves everything and will always move it, that it will bring power to those who possess it in real large amounts (unthinkable figures) and will sink those who think they have enough (poor people who think they are rich). The poor will continue to fill the voids of their lives with objects or "luxuries" that their little money will provide (if they do not take worse paths) and thus they will try not to think about how poor they are. From higher than where we believe the high spheres are in which we are made to believe that power is found, they will continue to move like puppets each segment of the world population, obviously in favor of (their) interests, and the poor will continue to waste their time fighting with other poor people of the same condition, arguing about how badly the country is going and how badly this or that one is doing it, which is nothing more than another piece of the system, but who, despite everything, takes turns in government every so often with their main rivals, due to the lack of rationality of the people, or by mere historicity that this entails.

In summary, they manage to easily lose our condition as people for that of chess figures, turning us against ourselves, making us argue among ourselves for a series of reasons that they are interested in us worrying about, in fact, here we are, arguing about concerns of a moral nature, while they increase their fortune at our expense and plan the next move on the world chessboard. (I do not speak of conspiracy theories nor do I think too much in my free time, these are absolute truths that are there, surrounding us all.)

PD: There are still those who think that the richest people in the world are known and appear in Forbes magazine with a smiling face… a real joke...

Greetings

[Kernel1.0]

Corruption, theft, and influence peddling have existed since before man was man, many or all species of primates steal, cheat, and try to get their children to mate with specimens of a higher caste.
And humans, as evolved as we believe we are, are still here like just another monkey, let's hope that before we go extinct we evolve a little more and this time not so much on a technological level but on a social level.

[Fassou]

And this post, it's over...

Bye!

P.D.: If you want to see a graphic summary of the exploitation and manipulation of political and economic powers on our planet, open the SPOILER.

!